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Seagulls

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by tabtab13, Sep 4, 2010.

  1. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Plan B - be more vigilant and be more aware of the environment you live in. A toddler in a push chair with an ice cream in an area with seagulls is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. A bit of common sense and it could have been avoided. I have never heard of a gull 'attacking' anyone for no good reason. If you have food in front of one, and it reckons it can get it off you without harm to itself, it will.
     
  2. 46traveller

    46traveller Member

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    Oh, right, so lets get this straight, according to your theory, all children, when at the seaside, may only eat ice cream indoors or they are asking to be attacked for being so foolish. Common sense has nothing to do with it, that's like saying don't go out with a gold ring on, you're bound to get mugged. When someone loses an eye, or worse, what then??
    I really hope your theory that Nature will sort it out, happens before the unthinkable makes front page news in The Cornishman. In the meantime I will go better prepared when in charge of grandchildren out and about. Now where did I put my cane ??
    Nothing personal gulls, but as I understand it, I have the God given right to travel Unhindered without fear or favour throughout the land. Now if anyone would care to take up the discussion with him, I'm sure he'll let you know that this is correct.
    The situation is simple, I will go about my travels, and obey the rules, if gulls do the same, no conflict. After all, I don't deliberately pick a fight, they do.
     
  3. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

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    In a nutshell, no one possesses a God Given Right to walk unhindered through this land, all manner of animals have this right long before you or I had any concept of rights, and look at what happened to them. We shot them all. Where does it end. The human race is but one life form of many.
     
  4. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Of course common sense has something to do with it. Pushing a toddler with an ice cream in an area where seagulls are is asking for trouble. No, you don't have to sit inside - just sit on a bench and stay close to the child - have the child facing you and just keep an eye out for gulls getting too close.

    If I had a gold ring, I wouldn't be worried about being mugged for it - unless I was waving it around in the vicinity of a group of 'suspect' individuals. Again, that's just common sense.

    As for losing an eye, that almost happened to me on a gull rescue. I wasn't using my common sense and the beak came far too close for my liking. It wasn't the bird's fault - it was mine.

    As for a God given right, I'm sorry, but that falls too close to the Wehrmacht's 'Gott Mit Uns' belt buckle mindset for my liking. Along with all the other numerous episodes in history where individuals have said 'it is my God given right to do x, y and z'.

    And surely you're not serious with the comment about 'gulls obeying the rules'. They may be intelligent birds, but not that smart.

    I am sorry about what happened to your grandchild - truly I am - but I do think you should consider what part you played in the incident and how it could have been avoided (or avoided in the future), rather than just shift all the responsibility on to a gull who saw an opportunity for some food - and took it.
     
  5. 46traveller

    46traveller Member

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    Golly I must be on the wrong rock, I had the audacity to think I had rights along with birds and beasts of the field. We didn't shoot them all, nature has killed more than us, entire species erradicated in the blink of an eye. Agreed on the human race is but one life form, can't change what we are born as, and we breed, train and persecute animals as the majority thinks it makes great entertainment, or scares burglars. I'm not them, I'm someone who will take action over ANY threat to my own or my families welfare. If you disagree with that sentiment, that's unfortunate, but that's all it is, I take full responsibillity for my actions, and do what I think is right or justified if that's a better term. No apologies will be given for action taken, that results in my family walking away unscathed. If anyone feels differently about their nearest and dearest, you need help.

    You still don't get it do you, next it will be "No children allowed with ice cream here" how far would you like the rest of us to bend to your ideas. And you quote German at me,ha. There's quite enough Health And Safety everywhere else, without worrying if it's safe to let your children play out. Sorry, but as I've explained above my family is a tad more important to me than most other things, especially if that thing is intent on attacking them, hungry or not, I will try to make it their last meal. If you think helping birds with broken wings is great, that's fine, whatever makes you happy. Being a proud grandad makes me happy, going for walks with them makes me happy. I've made it through life without killing anything I didn't eat, it would be a shame to spoil that record.

    Once again the deal is, They leave me alone, they're safe. I'm afraid I can't offer any more than that, nor will I ever.
     
  6. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    I think overall, you and I will need to just agree to disagree.

    I do agree on defending your family and I know I would if a situation arose that needed it. It also seems we share similar views on Health & Safety - some of the legislation just beggars belief and I do wonder where it will end.

    Where I disagree is on why the gull incident happened in the first place and your reaction to it of 'they need to be culled'. I don't think we'll see eye to eye on that.

    However, it has been a good debate and I'm always interested to hear what other people think. Hopefully there will be other subjects we can 'butt heads' on - in a civilised way, of course.

    I wish the best for your grandchild and hope he/she has recovered ok. Whatever our own thoughts may be, it must have been a terrifying moment for them.
     
  7. 46traveller

    46traveller Member

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    Being very honest about the incident, I was more frightened about what her mother would think of me, you know the shout, "You only had them for two hours, one crying his eyes out, the other with a bandage on". "That dress is ruined". "Oh just Go". I'm afraid sorry just didn't cut it that day.
    A very civilised difference of opinion, I agree.
     
  8. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Yes, of course, it must have been terrible for you too.

    I guess we all have things we are 'blinkered' about and animal welfare is mine. I saw a video once about what happens on Chinese fur farms and it was one of the most upsetting things I've experienced in my life. I am not ashamed to say I cried on and off for days afterwards. Seeing these things or reading about such things, the blinkers go on and and I'm primed to explode.

    There are comments I made to you I regret and for that, I do apologise. Being in a 'blinkered' state is no excuse.

    No doubt what happened also really shook you up (something I just didn't take into consideration) so I do hope that you are ok too now and things are all right between you and the mother as well.
     
  9. 46traveller

    46traveller Member

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    Hi TabTab, no apologies are necessary, a good discussion is the best medicine sometimes, and thanks yes all is well with "Mum" now. Kids call me Jonah, evidently they heard mum explaining to dad that something always happens when I'm around. As you get older your back gets broader I think, bounces off........
     
  10. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    Its the "please do not feed the seagulls" that causes half of the problem. Mankinds despicable tendency of thinking its the superior creature on this planet, being the other half.

    Seagulls are well-behaved if they are regularly fed. Ive spent the last ten years feeding an average of 75 gulls twice a day, every day. Ive sat in the garden having a barbecue when their feeding time was due and the birds landed and patiently waited for their tea. Absolutely NO, I repeat NO attempt from them to pinch my tea any more than I would pinch theirs. They knew they would be fed as soon as I was ready. I cook them Tuna Pasta Bake for Christmas dinner. I too have rescued seagulls with broken wings. I have raised a baby until it could fly.

    In my opinion, if you dont like the seagulls, then go elsewhere. I wouldnt go to London then complain about the traffic.......
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2010
  11. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Merlyn - you are a person after my own heart!

    We've never tried to raise any young gulls (I take them over to Mousehole) - I could see problems as we have 5 cats! However, a few years back when we had just two, we found a young, abandoned ducking. Its family had swum off and this one was left behind, water-logged and sinking - think we just got to it time. We took it home and took care of it and tried to get someone to take it (we weren't living in Penzance at the time so Mousehole wasn't an option).

    Neither the RSPB or RSPCA were interested and suggested just taking it back to where we found it and leaving it there. Now I'm no bird expert but I knew it wouldn't survive. So, I built a pen for it and tried other options. Eventually, one of my wife's friends said they'd take it as they had a farm and off it went and lived with some chickens and did very well. We had updates for a while and apparently it would fly off but come back every now and again for food. While we had it, we spent many an evening sitting outside by the pen and it was really rewarding watching it turn from a ball of fluff into a young duck.

    Perhaps we should have just left it and let Nature take its course. - that seems to be the consensus when it comes to wild animals.

    I've always been in two minds about that, I tend to believe a chain of events started millions of years ago, and in the case of the duckling as an example, ended with us being just right there at the right time to make a difference on whether it lived or died.

    Biggest gull I saved was a big Black Back. He was a bit battered and underweight but until you pick one up, you don't really appreciate just how big they are. If saving it wasn't reward enough, holding it and being that close to such a large, wild bird (which was such a thrill) was reward enough.
     
  12. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    Its great to know there are a couple of us around TabTab.

    I too believe your theory of being in a certain place at a certain time. If Im not meant to find an injured animal, then I would have passed through ten minutes earlier, or ten minutes later - or even gone a different way!

    11 years ago I found an injured wood pigeon in the garden. We took it to Mousehole. Suffice to say that since then, we decided to look after them ourselves. We paid the vets bills and administered medication. It was heartbreaking when one didnt make it - Ive had many birds die in my arms, usually in the wee hours of the morning. Between us, we'd mount a 24hr watch over new arrivals or any that had taken a turn for the worse. But the feeling of releasing a success back into the wild is.... well, words fail me.

    From a baby robin found at the side of the road, to a Buzzard with a broken wing, we've had most species... including a rabbit hit by a car (made a fabulous recovery and went on to have many young of her own in our garden) and a young fox (also hit by a car and made a great recovery)..... though not the rabbit and the fox at the same time!!!!!!

    At this point, I will add that the same theory works with foxes. Our foxes know theres a regular source of food day & night. Ive never seen a fox chase a rabbit (which are plentiful in our garden). In fact, I can push the boat further - I have, on several occasions, seen a fox in the middle of the day pass through the free-range chickens without a glance at them, in order to get to the food we put out.

    Ive had one dealing with a Black Back. And yes they certainly are very big and beautiful. My poor soul was wrapped with fishing line. He came every mealtime for a few days, gradually getting more trusting of me and thus would stand closer each time. Every day I prayed he would come and not got tangled somewhere with the 4ft length of line that was dangling from his wrapped-up legs. Patience was indeed a virtue. Finally he would stand close enough to me so I could stand on the "lead" he was on. Of course, when I bent down to get the line he tried to fly off. Very horrific for him to suddenly come to the end his tether, but it was the only way of getting him since there was nothing wrong with his wings. It took three of us to untangle him. One to hold his body, one to hold his head and the third to remove the line wrapped around his legs (which included having to very carefully snip at the line with very sharp scissors). Afterwards, we put him back in the garden. It took him a few minutes to realise what had happened but flew off a very happy bird despite his ordeal.

    I wish more people could see the beauty in these wonderful birds.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2010
  13. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Well, it's like looking into a mirror - were we separated at birth, I wonder?!!

    Excellent stories and heart warming too. You must post some pics if you have any - and any more stories you have too!

    Great stuff.
     
  14. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    LOL TabTab!!! They say we all have a double!!!!

    Pictures are more than plentiful!!! I have.... thousands!!!!!!! I see there is a "Wildlife" section for photos - do you want them posted there?

    It will take me a few weeks to sort through them for the best ones and Im a bit tied for time at the moment (decorating!), but I will certainly get some posted for you.
     
  15. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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    Excellent!! Can't wait to see them.

    You could either set up your own gallery on site and just post them there or just post them in the Wild Life Gallery, though there is the option to post them in your own gallery and the Wild Life section at the same time. If you have any problems when the time comes, let me know :)

    In the meantime, if you like cats, check out my 'Penzance Cats' gallery. Might make a nice break from the decorating!
     
  16. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    Thanks - I will let you know when Ive done them.... or shout if I get in a pickle!!!!

    I will indeed have a look at your cats gallery. I dont have such enthusiasm for cats, dogs, etc....... Im highly allergic to fur ::4: (hence my passion for birds, fish & wildlife), but at least photos wont make me sneeze & itch!!!!

    (and yes, looking after that rabbit I mentioned was an absolute nightmare for me!! It was in a bad way and took a good 3months to recover. Fortunately the fox was only in shock and was fine the next day)
     
  17. tabtab13

    tabtab13 Active Member

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  18. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    Is feeding seagulls in a public place actually against the law?? As they said in the link, the signs REQUEST people not to feed them. Im trying to think what our signs say (I dont take any notice of them LOL!!!!!), but Im pretty sure we're requested not to feed them. I know theres no law about feeding them in your own garden (neighbours tried enough times to have me stopped!!!!!!). It is illegal to shoot them though.

    Have just about finished with my decorating Tab Tab, so am currently getting my photos back onto my computer (had to format it). Will get some photos uploaded soon, as promised...... Ive not forgotten!!
     
  19. Halfhidden

    Halfhidden Untouchable Staff Member Administrator

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    @Merlyn It is against the law to feed seagulls in a public area. Many years ago now the Penwith Council created a by-law to curb the holidays makers feeding and encouraging seagulls. As far as I know there are no laws that prevent you from feeding seagulls in your own garden. That said, noise and nuisance acts as well as anti social behaviour orders can be used against people who encourage seagulls to the extent of annoying or upsetting other immediate neighbours. To be honest the police don't have this kind of thing in their priority lists.
    You asked can you shoot a seagull in your garden and is that legal? The answer is yes and no. Yes you can shoot a seagull in your garden if you consider it a pest, yet you are required not to cause the animal any unnecessary suffering, so your shot would require that the seagull was dispatched in one. If you injure the seagull you are likely to be prosecuted.
    Also if you got in the pest control guys and the seagull is captured (even though completely unharmed) the pest control company has to kill the seagull... its the law!
    Complete bonkers isn't it?
     
  20. Merlyn

    Merlyn

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    Managed to sort a couple of seagull pics.

    Here's a few of "my" clan getting breakfast in the snow.
    View attachment 209

    Salty & Pepper. Both have half a wing missing. They'd go out into the garden first thing in the morning and come in just before dusk. Pepper, being a baby, looked upon Salty for companionship. Salty, being an older bird wasnt interested. She'd got enough problems. Sadly, 6 months after Pepper came along, Salty got tired of living.
    View attachment 210

    Here she is enjoying a bit of peace & quiet in her pool. This photo was taken a few days before she died.
    View attachment 211

    The following summer, a group of lads kept coming to shoot at Pepper over the garden gate. It took them over two months, but they finally got her as she ran away. I presume Im not allowed to swear on here, but if the guilty b*st**ds are reading this, go and research what Karma means........

    But there were also success stories. This is Winnie. She was brought to me by a friend. She and her sibling kept falling off the shed roof. They kept getting put back up, but kept falling off. Then her sibling was found dead on the floor and I was asked if I fancied raising a baby seagull. Enter Winnie. Beautiful, beautiful bird. The first time she tried to fly off, she got a few hundred feet then crashed. We couldnt find her. That evening, she came tumbling out of the gorse and trotted up the garden. Looked after her for another few weeks before she went for her second attempt at leaving the "nest"!! She got higher and further... then went down somewhere. Again, couldnt find her. The next evening, there she was in the garden LOL!!!! She knew where to come! A few weeks later, third time lucky! She did it. Up she went, strong and healthy. She circled the garden several times getting higher & higher before gracefully flying off. She came back every day with all the others for breakfast & dinner!!!
    View attachment 212
     

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