This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Picture Penzance is free to join and use. So why not join our community. As a member you can upload images, add comments, participate in our contests and connect with like minded people.
    All the best,
    Halfhidden (founder member)

Sign up for free today
Membership Is Free
No Adds
Members Only Areas
And lots More!

CLICK HERE

Harbour Marina plan

Discussion in 'Harbours' started by treeve, Mar 24, 2008.

?

Harbour Marina plan should it happen?

  1. Yes

    50.0%
  2. No

    50.0%
  3. Don't know

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
  2. Planet Penwith

    Planet Penwith Super User

    Messages:
    298
    Likes Received:
    260
    Well I support the idea of it being built in principle. It would help to regenerate PZ and help create jobs and would be a success, eventually. Lets hope (if it goes ahead) the council dosen't mismanage such a huge undertaking.

    Potential problems:

    As for the jobs, would they be taken by locals, or the current or any future influx of immigrant workers? They are able to under-cut the local skilled labour in wages paid. This has to be sensibly thought out....Hopefully plenty for both.

    Another problem is the enviroment and "visual" change in the area. There would obviously be large scale building work and hopefully there would be plans put in place to minimalise the amount of "damage" to the enviroment. Also to minimalise any "eyesore" out-comes. A fine line.

    Property prices too would be affected. It's bound to affect locals starting on the property ladder and of course those already on it. It would benefit and inhibit buyers, sellers.

    There are other areas of potential problems too and I would imagine other users will no doubt outline them here. Lets have a debate on it?

    Sorry if this post is sketchy! and I could be talking complete and utter rubbish! ah well! [​IMG]
     
  3. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    Good start, outlined many of the problems that I see. I am reminded of the Chuck Berry song (when R&B meant Rhythm & Blues) .. "he got what he wanted, but he lost what he had". To me the whole scheme is ill considered and poses more threat to our town than it provides the solutions to many problems which have arisen from ill-considered short term solutions that have been made in the past. How does this all fit into the general scheme of things when considering the Newlyn Marina? I have seen too many high-falooting reports with fancy headings and long words with no real substance in the past. This proposal has all the earmarks of a fresh development that will have serious impact on our infrastructure and communications; in isolation, maybe it works, but as a forefront to our town, we will be lost. The very view that people will be "buying" will be lost behind a fanfare of luxury yachts, and our streets will be filled with hooray henrys, and bang goes the local market for housing, bang goes our cost of living, as it all rises to meet the demand from those that can well aford it. And who pays for all of this? Are you prepared to pay the extra Rates for something we would not nor could afford to use?

    Hawkwind is more my bag, I have to add !!
     
  4. Planet Penwith

    Planet Penwith Super User

    Messages:
    298
    Likes Received:
    260
    I did omit to include the changes needed to the transport infrastructure....roads, rail etc. It would be a HUGE undertaking if it did get off the ground.

    Hawkwind are ok! [​IMG]
     
  5. mrsullysgirl

    mrsullysgirl

    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think it would be fantastic if the harbor could handle cruise ships. This would boost the Penwith community at a huge scale. Then I can cruise from Florida to Penzance to see my family.
     
  6. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    The Isles of Scilly already handles Cruise ships very well without the need to enclose and destroy what they have there; Penzance could handle Cruise ships now, the Bay is well and truly big enough, one of the largest natural harbours in Britain .. quite safe and protected, quite deep, and plenty of anchorage; just don't come here when there is a South Easterly. [​IMG] Cruise ships call in at Falmouth (including the Saga ships) and Falmouth is only "a couple of scats away" from Penzance.
     
  7. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    I was very interested in the report on the development at Plymouth, where it has been admitted that development exceeded the capablities of Plymouth to service the use and users of the marina and flats. They also admit that there is a growing problem with drink related nuisance, vandalism and crime; they cannot even agree on a sensible working policy to stop that growth. There were many other issues surrounding that development which had been allowed, indeed, encouraged. If a city the size of Plymouth cannot cope nor vision just what a development entails and generates, how does Penzance think it can do any better?
     
  8. denanmor

    denanmor Member

    Messages:
    253
    Likes Received:
    13
    I am torn. On one hand I agree that Penzance should be looking to the future a little more, because as it is it is going nowhere. A marina and some of the other ideas would make sense. On the other hand the look of Penzance would be destroyed through such a huge undertaking. I am sure the new breakwater would not be built of granite like the existing piers. The rest of it would probably not fit in either. And one of the best views in Penzance would be gone forever. (see below) On the final hand (yes, I do have three, please don't treat me like a freak) there has to be progress. The history of Penzance is built on it... And no one at the time probably agreed with it. "What? A big huge pier being built there? What an eyesore." " A bathing pool you say? Looking like a seagull? You're as daft as a wagon 'oss!"
    [​IMG]
     
  9. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    I think there are always places in history where we can ask, why was that done, or suggest that it would spoil the environment or spoil the scenery. No one has asked the question as to just how the Isles of Scilly ferry is to negotiate her way over the low water rocks to the east of Albert Pier, or just how the berthed yachts will fare with rocks that are exposed at Medium low tides, let alone extreme low tides. And what of the depth of water at the entrance to this proposed marina, and the rocks which are to be found in those waters. Has a survey been done to discover the effects of this work on the sea currents and as to what happens to the sand of the beaches and shore line? Having watched the present surge, I am concerned at the effects on any vessels approaching those interior waters. At least the Jubilee Pool was built over wharves and rocks that were already a striking barrier and did not radically alter sea flow. That huge pier (Albert Pier) was there to ensure a protected harbour (which it most certainly was not since the first pier of around 1500), it provided access for industry and cargo (which is does not now provide); our harbour has been chopped in half in obeisance to the motor car, and so less space is availabe for water borne traffic. At very low tides, it is possible (though sticky) to walk from Albert Pier to South Pier, rendering this new marina useless.
     
  10. Harvey69

    Harvey69 Senior Member

    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    72
    Newlyn will need something to fill the gap left by the fishing industry, might as well look after rich boys toys. Anyway never know 50 years down the road the fishing industry maybe thriving again, hopefully. :D
     
  11. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    Good point Darren T{.. myself, I cannot see the point in having a Marina at Penzance, as well as the one at Newlyn; who knows what will be happening in 50 years time, there may not even be any sea in Mount's Bay 8). There may even be a market for touring house boats; assuming the determination is agreed that they are not houses, under Planning Laws ;D ....
     
  12. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    Good point, Paul. I am all for increasing the use of the Bay and the harbour, but the reason why the harbour is less functional than it was designed to be is a combination of many factors, not the least of which is that trade is not as it was (movement of grain, granite and ore, etc), we simply have very little that is shipped by sea, we have these gigantic uneconomical pollutants and village destroyers of trucks going to and fro. Cruise ships pass us by, occasionally heading for the Roads of Scilly, there is to be a marina at Newlyn, the bay needs a lot of channelling to get it useable by larger vessels in any case, and then there is the total nonsense of the positioning for the new marina - right over a bed of (I believe) blue elvan, which is exposed at low tide. I have already said that the town cannot supply the Monaco Marina standard of accommodation, restaurants, services, supplies etc; traffic would be impossible, and we locals will be squeezed out of the town, and our pockets will be drained by the advent of "tourist prices". On top of all that, the area required to be extended about covers the area that someone with very short sight filled half of the harbour we had. All I am saying is that some wider consideration needs to be applied, which adds to the experience, not destroys it.
     
  13. ibrowze

    ibrowze Senior Member

    Messages:
    105
    Likes Received:
    8
    I'm in favour of anything that's going to add the cultural landscape of Penzance given the recent decline of quality street entertainment. @@@
     
  14. sparky

    sparky Authoritarian Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    6,042
    Likes Received:
    206
    This has NOTHING!! to do with the Harbour??? ( your entertainment or any one else's!!!)
    Entertainment has nothing to do with this.......there will be a 40 ft wall above sea level....to accommodate the buildings and vessel's this is going to spoil the views of Penzance...BIG TIME!!! If you have a guest house looking towards the Mount...called the guest house you may want to call it the wall guest house?????
    and 2000 years of mount view has gone for some....
     
  15. treeve

    treeve Major Contributor

    Messages:
    3,074
    Likes Received:
    118
    That is a bit Monty Python ... I remember the "architect sketch", where the call was for an old people's home ... the architect rattles on (John Cleese) about his scheme and quickly passes over a comment in which we hear the expressions "corridor with rotating metal knives", the comittee are stunned, and ask the architect to confirm, which he did ... "of course we won't call it that, they may not like to live there" ... so, if we call the nuclear power plant a mini-kettle, it will be approved by the locals that care.... What's in a name?

    ibrowze, in some context I agree with adding to cultural landscape ... I am interested to know what your definition is of cultural landscape in the context of a marina (under whatever name, in whatever language) which will envelope the people in Penzance so they will not be able to see the bay from the harbour area.
    How would that long long sea wall improve our cultural landscape?

    Sparky you have said a wild piece, well said. T{
     
  16. ibrowze

    ibrowze Senior Member

    Messages:
    105
    Likes Received:
    8
    Well excuse me Sparky for taking the time out to follow the link kindly provided by treeve in the initial post, but the proposed plan for harbour development clearly shows a designated 'Public open space and events area'. I innocently assumed this to refer to a possible site for entertainment or some forms of cultural exhibition. If I've misinterpreted that phrase then please enlighten me. O0
     
  17. bltflyer123

    bltflyer123

    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    see! an alternative site for you to play at!
     
  18. Halfhidden

    Halfhidden Untouchable Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    2,831
    Likes Received:
    943
    Because of abuse the edit function of this and future polls will be removed. Previous posts have been edited to favour the author, and will not be tolerated!
     
  19. duffy

    duffy Member

    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    0
    Don't know!!

    Been away for so long, yet have a similar situation here in Salalah ( OMAN) . Checkout

    http://www.salalahbeach.com

    see what they are promising. Is it in line with the developers in your place????

    We here don't want this intrusion.

    But hey!! who are we, just expats, that is all!!!
    :-D XXXXXX
     
  20. Halfhidden

    Halfhidden Untouchable Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    2,831
    Likes Received:
    943
    A quick look at the link makes me feel that this might be a well thought out development. But then I have no idea about local needs or wants. In our case it's pretty likely that a huge wall will need to be built in order to create the protection needed for the marina. Looking out to see from Penzance most properties along the sea front will see St Michaels Mount. Once the wall has been erected they will only see... wall! I'm sure this will look an eyesore and will blank out basically the biggest and best attraction that we have.
    I think I'm right... unless someone would like to correct me on thisĀ  :-X :D
    What are the objections to the harbour plan near you Duffy, or are people happy for the change?
     

Share This Page